European Guitars Forums

by **nate_lamy** » Wed Dec 23, 2009 7:00 am

Regarding Roger guitars, Wenzel ended up offering the Super model with cats-eye soundholes as well as regular Roger-style F-holes. I have seen more than six Roger Supers with f-holes and have a variety of loose Roger Super top plates with f-holes.
Super top plates with cats-eye soundholes were graded and cut separately from Junior/Standard/Luxus top plates - they couldn't be swapped with those models because of the shape of the holes. However, Super top plates with Roger-style f-holes were ALSO graded and cut separately - the f-holes were cut bigger to accommodate the single layer of perloid binding found on Super top plates.
The auction guitar to which you refer is one of the last Supers built (with a Neumarkt St. Veit label), and was clearly put together with available parts as evidenced by the Luxus-style binding, the plastic Roger logo on the headstock, and so forth.
Wenzel made minor changes to the specifications of the Mittenwald-built Roger guitars throughout their production lives, so my current thinking is that he started with the cats-eye soundholes on the Super and eventually moved to Roger-style f-holes on the Super.

Here is the list of serial numbers to date for Roger archtop guitars, moved here for convenience:
The Berlin guitars are non-cutaway unless noted on the labels as cutaway:
-------------------------------------
Schonbach:
Nr. 35
Nr. 39
Nr. 50
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Berlin:
Nr. 109
Nr. 115
Nr. 133
Nr. 200
Nr. 243 - Super - Berlin label - non-cut - blonde-9 layer neck-Roger & motif Inlaid into black on small head like Lang
Nr. 273 - Standard - Berlin label - non-cut - sunburst - Roger script logo on overlaid, bound, symmetrical headstock
Nr. 280
Nr. 346 - Junior - Berlin label - non-cut - dark red - flatback, mahogany back and rims, 13th fret neck/body joint
399
401
Nr. 517 - http://www.vintageaudioberlin.de.
Nr. 526 - Junior - Berlin label - non-cut - sunburst - flatback, maple back and rims -9 layer neck
Nr. 535 - Super (ebay)
Nr. 565
Nr. 594 - Super non-cut - blond cats-eye sound-holes (http://www.banjoworld.de, april 08)
Nr. 600 - Junior - Berlin label - non-cut -sunburst - flatback, birds-eye maple, plain maple rims
Nr. 618 - Cut away - Berlin label - sunburst - carved back, flamed maple, flamed maple rims - This is actually a Super
Nr. 673 - Junior - non-cut - blond (ebay, december 08)
Nr. 684
Nr. 711 - Junior - Berlin label - non-cut - refin - flatback, rosewood, flamed maple rims
Nr. 723
Nr. 733 - Junior Cut away - Berlin label - redburst - flatback 2 piece, flamed maple, flamed maple rims
Nr. 757
Nr. 777
Nr. 824
Nr. 1012 - Standard - Berlin label - sunburst - carved back, flamed maple w/dark center strip, flamed maple rims
-------------------------------------
Mittenwald:
Nr. 1500
Nr. 1508 - JUNIOR - sans-serif label - non-cut - sunburst - no decal, old headstock (refinished), zero fret, white inlays
Nr. 1565
Nr. 1610 - JUNIOR CA - sans-serif label - sunburst - new decal. old headstock
Nr. 1618 - STANDARD CA. - sans-serif label - braun schattiert - old decal, old headstock -
Nr. 1638 - Junior CA - sunburst (source unknown)
Nr. 1673 - Junior CA - natural - tortoise binding - old decal, old headstock (ebay)
Nr. 1678
Nr. 1705
Nr. 1714 - JUNIOR CA - sans-serif label - sunburst - old decal, old headstock
Nr. 1721 - JUNIOR CA naturell - sans-serif label - no decal, old headstock - replacement fingerboard/ zero fret
Nr. 1727 - STANDARD CA- serif label - sunburst - old decal, old headstock
Nr. 1735
Nr. 1758 - non-cut, sunburst, black decal - old headstock. Right soundhole widened. No pix of label.Thx,ol'fret
Nr. 1810
Nr. 1870 - JUNIOR CA - sans-serif label - sunburst - new decal, old headstock - Standard neck/Junior body
Nr. 2022
Nr. 2077
Nr. 2087 - STANDARD CA - sans-serif label - sunburst - old decal, old headstock - Standard neck/body- purchased 1957
Nr. 2195 - Luxus CA - sans-serif label - blonde - new decal, old headstock
Nr. 2252
Nr. 2259 - Luxus Ultra CA - blonde - new decal, new bound headstock, Thx, ol'fret/Stefan
Nr. 2277 - JUNIOR Cut Away - blonde - smashed guitar sold on eBay Germany - No decal - old headstock. Thx,ol'fret
Nr. 2289 - Junior CA naturell - sans-serif label - blonde
Nr. 2308
Nr. 2331 - JUNIOR Cut away - sans-serif label -sunburst,
Nr. 2308 - Super Cut Away - sans-serif label - sunburst - f-holes
Nr. 2449 - cutaway, blonde, black decal - new headstock. No pix of label. Thx, ol'fret
Nr. 2518 - Junior CA blond (from manningsmusicals.co.uk/) - new decal, new head - bound board/head
Nr. 2629
Nr. 2655
Nr. 2688
Nr. 2724
Nr. 2741
Nr. 2765 - Junior CA blond - tortoise binding, new decal, new head. Thx, Steve K.
Nr. 2859
Nr. 2909
Nr. 2947 - Super CA nat. - serif label - blonde - Cats-eye sound-holes
Nr. 2961 - JUNIOR CA nat. - (confimed by Uli Weber) - serif label - blonde - new decal, new head
Nr. 2987
Nr. 3017 - Super CA ULTRA. - serif label - blonde - Cats-eye sound-holes
Nr. 3037 - Junior Cut Away - sans-serif label - sunburst - new decal, old head -
Nr. 3112
Nr. 3248 - JUNIOR CA nat. - serif label - blonde - new decal, new head
Nr. 3252
Nr. 3268 - JUNIOR CA nat. - serif label - blonde - L-5 style - new decal, new head - bound board/head
Nr. 3390 - JUNIOR CA EXp. – sunburst - sans-serif label - Neumarkt-St. Veit, Oberbayern - blue stamped
Nr. 3449
-------------------------------------------
Odd numbers
Nr. 66/56 GX - Modell: Super Cutaway - style 2 label - later guitar, wrong label- it's a Junior - L-5 style - new headstock w/Schallers

by **Ol' Fret** » Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:46 pm

Again two Roger Junior (Mittenwald) serial numbers for the database (guitars recently sold at German ebay):
1. #1758 non-cut, sunburst, black decal on old headstock. Right soundhole widened. No pic of the paper label inside.
2. #2449 cutaway, blonde, black decal on new headstock. No pic of the paper label. The seller wasn't sure about the first digit, but it must be #2449.